[brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights

-ray ray at ops.selu.edu
Mon Mar 8 13:40:15 CST 2010 

So you believe that private US defense contractors, who've developed 
weapons and technologies under the auspices of the US government, should 
be allowed to freely trade said weapons and technologies to countries such 
as China, Russia, Cuba, Iran, Syria, Lebanon, Sudan, and North Korea?



On Mon, 8 Mar 2010, Ryan McCain wrote:

> I don't agree with his conclusions but the meat of the article should 
> give you enough information if you want to start researching the issue 
> any further.  We are supposed to be sovereign.  Someone who is sovereign 
> doesn't ask permission of anyone to trade goods and services.
>
>
> Ryan McCain
> Northrop Grumman Corporation
> Email: ryan.mccain at la.gov
> Phone: 225.505.3832
>
> Registered Linux User #364609
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: general-bounces at brlug.net [mailto:general-bounces at brlug.net] On Behalf Of -ray
> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 12:53 PM
> To: 'general at brlug.net'
> Subject: Re: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights
>
>
> Yes, a nice, long writeup.  And the conclusion of section IIIB seems to support my point:
>
> "...and the term "To regulate" means "to make regular"--that is, to specify how an activity may be transacted--when applied to domestic commerce, but also includes the power to make "prohibitory regulations"
> when applied to foreign trade. In sum, Congress has power to specify rules to govern the manner by which people may exchange or trade goods from one state to another, to remove obstructions to domestic trade erected by states, and to both regulate and restrict the flow of goods to and from other nations (and the Indian tribes) for the purpose of promoting the domestic economy and foreign trade."
> http://www.bu.edu/rbarnett/Original.htm#IIIB
>
> The term "to regulate", when applied to foreign trade, definitely does NOT mean "to not interfere".  Not interfering is more applicable to domestic trade.
>
> That said, and to steer this back on topic, I think this Human Bill of Rights legislation is pure and utter crap from the most bleeding heart liberal in congress.  If the federal government wants to do something about human rights violations in China (or anywhere), then do something, damnit.  Do not punish US companies cause you don't have the balls to stand up to China yourself.
>
> ray
>
>
> On Fri, 5 Mar 2010, Ryan McCain wrote:
>
>> Here's a good writeup on this....
>>
>> http://www.bu.edu/rbarnett/Original.htm
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: general-bounces at brlug.net [mailto:general-bounces at brlug.net] On
>> Behalf Of -ray
>> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 5:36 PM
>> To: 'general at brlug.net'
>> Subject: Re: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights
>>
>>
>> I always goofed off in civics and history class, so I had to goto WIkipedia.
>>
>> Enumerated powers, Article 1, Section 8, Clause 3 of the US Constitution states Congress has the power:
>>
>> To regulate commerce with foreign nations, and among the several
>> states, and with the Indian tribes;
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_One_of_the_United_States_Constitu
>> tion#Enumerated_powers
>>
>> How does deciding who a company can trade with *NOT* fall under regulating commerce with foreign nations?
>>
>> ray
>>
>> On Thu, 4 Mar 2010, Ryan McCain wrote:
>>
>>> The Constitution enumerates all the powers of the government.  Deciding who a company can trade with isn't one of them.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: general-bounces at brlug.net [mailto:general-bounces at brlug.net] On
>>> Behalf Of -ray
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 4:30 PM
>>> To: 'general at brlug.net'
>>> Subject: Re: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights
>>>
>>>
>>> I don't think it is unlawful or unconstitutional for the government to forbid an American company, say Northrop Grumman, from doing any business with a foreign company, say Iran.  For obvious reasons.
>>>
>>> You can do business with China though.  Then they'll do business with Iran.
>>>
>>> Oh wait.  When you say overlords, did you mean our Chinese overlords?
>>> :)
>>>
>>> ray
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 3 Mar 2010, Ryan McCain wrote:
>>>
>>>> The majority of what our overlords do is unlawful.  Positive law isn't legit if it violates the Constitution.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Ryan McCain
>>>> Northrop Grumman Corporation
>>>> Email: ryan.mccain at la.gov
>>>> Phone: 225.505.3832
>>>>
>>>> Registered Linux User #364609
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> From: general-bounces at brlug.net [mailto:general-bounces at brlug.net]
>>>> On Behalf Of Dustin Puryear
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 3:28 PM
>>>> To: general at brlug.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights
>>>>
>>>> Do you mean they have no moral or legal authority? They certainly have the legal authority (e.g., Cuba, munitions).
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Puryear IT, LLC - Baton Rouge, LA - http://www.puryear-it.com/
>>>> Active Directory Integration : Web & Enterprise Single Sign-On
>>>> Identity and Access Management : Linux/UNIX technologies
>>>>
>>>> Download our free ebook "Best Practices for Linux and UNIX Servers"
>>>> http://www.puryear-it.com/pubs/linux-unix-best-practices/
>>>>
>>>> From: general-bounces at brlug.net [mailto:general-bounces at brlug.net]
>>>> On Behalf Of Ryan McCain
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 2:19 PM
>>>> To: 'general at brlug.net'
>>>> Subject: Re: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights
>>>>
>>>> Our government has 0 authority to tell private companies who their customers can and cannot be.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 08:48:31 -0600
>>>> From: dpuryear at puryear-it.com
>>>> To: general at brlug.net
>>>> Subject: [brlug-general] Internet Human Bill of Rights Now, this may
>>>> be a good idea:
>>>>
>>>> http://www.pcworld.com/article/190579/senator_to_introduce_internet_
>>>> h
>>>> u
>>>> man_rights_bill.html
>>>>
>>>> The basic idea: The law "would impose criminal or civil penalties on U.S. Internet companies that bow to pressure of foreign governments and violate human rights."
>>>>
>>>> Still, this creates a cache-22. This would essentially bar US companies from competing in markets like China, which are huge. So would this put our companies at a long-term disadvantage?
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps this law makes more sense if it applies to *ANY* company that operates in the US.
>>>>
>>>> ---
>>>> Puryear IT, LLC - Baton Rouge, LA - http://www.puryear-it.com/
>>>> Active Directory Integration : Web & Enterprise Single Sign-On
>>>> Identity and Access Management : Linux/UNIX technologies
>>>>
>>>> Download our free ebook "Best Practices for Linux and UNIX Servers"
>>>> http://www.puryear-it.com/pubs/linux-unix-best-practices/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>> Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it
>>>> now.<http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469228/direct/01/>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
>>> Ray DeJean  				       	 http://www.r-a-y.org
>>> Systems Engineer                    Southeastern Louisiana University
>>> IBM Certified Specialist  	      AIX Administration, AIX Support
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>>>
>>>
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>> Ray DeJean  				       	 http://www.r-a-y.org
>> Systems Engineer                    Southeastern Louisiana University
>> IBM Certified Specialist  	      AIX Administration, AIX Support
>> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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>>
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> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
> Ray DeJean  				       	 http://www.r-a-y.org
> Systems Engineer                    Southeastern Louisiana University
> IBM Certified Specialist  	      AIX Administration, AIX Support
> =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
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>
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-- 
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Ray DeJean  				       	 http://www.r-a-y.org
Systems Engineer                    Southeastern Louisiana University
IBM Certified Specialist  	      AIX Administration, AIX Support
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=

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